Comments on: Understanding the Stag Hunt Game: How Deer Hunting Explains Why People are Socially Late http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/ Articles on game theory and personal finance Thu, 29 Jul 2010 12:43:59 -0500 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Alex http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/comment-page-1/#comment-5705 Alex Wed, 14 Oct 2009 03:52:15 +0000 http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/#comment-5705 funny I read this now. some friends and myself went to see Zombieland recently for a midnight showing. based on the size of the group we had (roughly 20), we thought there would be a huge demand to see this movie opening night. however, only a few of us had bought tickets in advance and we wanted to make sure everyone could go. a few people argued that they would probably be able to get tickets and said they'd show up later than we wanted to leave, so a friend faked a phone call and said his "friend" said that there were tons of people there already. immediately, everyone was ready to leave and we made it there with plenty of time to spare. In our case, it was better that everyone got tickets and had a good time than to risk it and have only half of us able to go. we also got to play a fun game with them and see their interest in leaving skyrocket. funny I read this now. some friends and myself went to see Zombieland recently for a midnight showing. based on the size of the group we had (roughly 20), we thought there would be a huge demand to see this movie opening night. however, only a few of us had bought tickets in advance and we wanted to make sure everyone could go. a few people argued that they would probably be able to get tickets and said they’d show up later than we wanted to leave, so a friend faked a phone call and said his “friend” said that there were tons of people there already. immediately, everyone was ready to leave and we made it there with plenty of time to spare. In our case, it was better that everyone got tickets and had a good time than to risk it and have only half of us able to go. we also got to play a fun game with them and see their interest in leaving skyrocket.

]]> By: Alex http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/comment-page-1/#comment-5307 Alex Thu, 11 Jun 2009 15:18:13 +0000 http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/#comment-5307 I just want to point out that, returning home with nothing, the 0 in your stag hunt grid doesn't represent "shame" it represents not eating. The other hunter may choose rabbit more often to either guarantee he has food, or to have the possibility of making the other person do without, which would eventually make his clan die out unless he started hunting rabbits as well. Leading to an evolutionary weeding out of stag hunters. Also, the original game had 3 hunters, with one of them being tempted by a rabbit running across the path, meaning he could either help the group and share a potential big prize, or gaurantee his own interests to the detriment of the others. It then becomes the best option for everyone to chase the rabbit, because without three hunters you can't hunt a stag at all. The moral of the game being that it only takes one player looking out for his own interests to make cooperation break down. It was later used as an illustration of the power of the shadow of the future. If a person is known to cause the break down of the stag hunt, he will not be trusted or invited to the hunt again, and if the game is iterated multiple times the rational actor will always cooperate, or risk being left out of the hunt altogether. The logical conclusion here is that if people are late stop inviting them to your parties, and tell them that in advance. I just want to point out that, returning home with nothing, the 0 in your stag hunt grid doesn’t represent “shame” it represents not eating. The other hunter may choose rabbit more often to either guarantee he has food, or to have the possibility of making the other person do without, which would eventually make his clan die out unless he started hunting rabbits as well. Leading to an evolutionary weeding out of stag hunters.
Also, the original game had 3 hunters, with one of them being tempted by a rabbit running across the path, meaning he could either help the group and share a potential big prize, or gaurantee his own interests to the detriment of the others. It then becomes the best option for everyone to chase the rabbit, because without three hunters you can’t hunt a stag at all. The moral of the game being that it only takes one player looking out for his own interests to make cooperation break down. It was later used as an illustration of the power of the shadow of the future. If a person is known to cause the break down of the stag hunt, he will not be trusted or invited to the hunt again, and if the game is iterated multiple times the rational actor will always cooperate, or risk being left out of the hunt altogether.
The logical conclusion here is that if people are late stop inviting them to your parties, and tell them that in advance.

]]> By: Presh Talwalkar http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/comment-page-1/#comment-3539 Presh Talwalkar Tue, 11 Nov 2008 09:53:12 +0000 http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/#comment-3539 <b><em>Jess</b></em>: Good question. The difference in the games is the Prisoner's dilemma has only one equilibrium (both defect) whereas the Stag-hunt game has two (both cooperate, both defect). Both games are games of cooperation, but in the Stag-hunt there is hope you can get to the "good" outcome. In the Prisoner's dilemma, defect is a dominant strategy and only the bad outcome is possible. The Stag-hunt is probably more useful since games in life have many equilibria, and its a question of how you can get to the good ones. Governments play a big role is creating cooperation. Tim Harford wrote a nice article about this in Slate: http://www.slate.com/id/2174706/ Jess:
Good question. The difference in the games is the Prisoner’s dilemma has only one equilibrium (both defect) whereas the Stag-hunt game has two (both cooperate, both defect).

Both games are games of cooperation, but in the Stag-hunt there is hope you can get to the “good” outcome. In the Prisoner’s dilemma, defect is a dominant strategy and only the bad outcome is possible.

The Stag-hunt is probably more useful since games in life have many equilibria, and its a question of how you can get to the good ones. Governments play a big role is creating cooperation.

Tim Harford wrote a nice article about this in Slate:
http://www.slate.com/id/2174706/

]]> By: Jess http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/comment-page-1/#comment-3488 Jess Sat, 08 Nov 2008 20:12:01 +0000 http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/#comment-3488 The pareto optimal choice in the prisoners dilemma also depends on 'risk'. If one chooses to stay silent, he's risking to serve full sentence if the other does not cooperate. What would you say is the main difference between the Prisoners dilemma and the Stag hunt? The equilibria seem the same to me? Is it that the defect outcome in the stag hunt does not depend on the other party? thanks! The pareto optimal choice in the prisoners dilemma also depends on ‘risk’. If one chooses to stay silent, he’s risking to serve full sentence if the other does not cooperate. What would you say is the main difference between the Prisoners dilemma and the Stag hunt? The equilibria seem the same to me? Is it that the defect outcome in the stag hunt does not depend on the other party?
thanks!

]]> By: Presh Talwalkar http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/comment-page-1/#comment-1947 Presh Talwalkar Thu, 12 Jun 2008 04:55:43 +0000 http://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/06/03/understanding-the-stag-hunt-game-how-deer-hunting-explains-why-people-are-socially-late/#comment-1947 <b><em>Michael Webster</b></em>: Thanks for the additional book recommendations. Schelling does an excellent job of putting these games into a social context, as you point out. Michael Webster: Thanks for the additional book recommendations.

Schelling does an excellent job of putting these games into a social context, as you point out.

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